Alberich -

While I don't agree with you 100%, you certainly helped me see your point of view and I really appreciate that. It's an interesting debate, I think we can all agree on that.

Brad Quote

Of course a models regulars will still take them private but how is a model who is maybe in the middle levels suppose to attract new customers to take her private when the next model along is offering a dildo show for less than the cost of a 5 minute private?

How do they do it now? Some don't. Some try the site for a few days, a week, beautiful engaging performers and they can't get over the hump of attracting a regular group of chatters.


how does this help her if she doesn't want to offer a public show? What happens when she gets the notice she needs more privates or will no longer be on the site?

It helps her because there would simply be a lot more people in the system, looking around. If you were to have a lot more people in the system.


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So, what's the difference between the two? Simply that in the second scenario, someone is made to feel special (in a private manner - not some listing on some Fan game, not at the expense of others); in the tipping scenario, one person is made to feel cheap, flashing and showing for whatever is tossed their way.

I think it's a terrific idea and one definitely worth further study. We certainly aren't opposed to giving stuff for free as you said earlier in your post. We were giving away six-figures in free credits last month with the promotions (in terms of the cost to pay performers for those credits) and this month we're giving $1,500 per day in prizes for the Model Appreciation Days.

Brad



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Flirt is the Porche 911 of cam sites... Do you really want to trade it in for a Honda?
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Flirt is the Porche 911 of cam sites... Do you really want to trade it in for a Honda?




FUCK hondas! and which version of the 911? Aren't there like 100?
GT mmmmm! Quote

Why settle for a 911 flirt needs to be striving to be the Bugatti Veyron ofcam sites. Quote

Being the biggest doesn't always mean the best Brad. There's a lot of porn out there if someone wants to see tits and ass.

Of course a models regulars will still take them private but how is a model who is maybe in the middle levels suppose to attract new customers to take her private when the next model along is offering a dildo show for less than the cost of a 5 minute private? how does this help her if she doesn't want to offer a public show? What happens when she gets the notice she needs more privates or will no longer be on the site?


::quote_end:

You wrote my thoughts Sweet Chili. I don't want to do shows in my public room hell I rarely show my nipples unless I am coming out of a pvt time; but now I am concerned that if other models are doing this stuff for so cheap in public that I won't have that many people in my room and I will be constantly insulted for not showing my goodies in public room. ): Quote

Please don't make F4F into one of those cheap tacky sites where the poor models have ta bear their tonsils for free ta get a lil attention ... it's degrading and undermines the bewty been able ta dance the flirt ... there r a thousand other ways to up the turnover!

Why not go up market rather than down market??




And here we have the "degrading" word,,etc, etc, etc ,etc, etc, etc,


Here you go. And yes I know I reposted these. But oh well.

Define cheap site? Would you call a site cheap if its ranked number 500 or so on the world wide web? I wouldn't call that cheap at all... I would call that site a SUCCESS!

So before anyone goes off on calling something they have no clue about cheap I suggest you take a look at web statistics and learn a few things about current methods for success.
According to some of the best web statistical pages on the web itself, the sites using these methods of tipping have jumped over 20,000 spots in less then a year.

The method of tipping is the next best thing.. And if VS decides to go with that. Then i'll just be working that much harder.
So I think that everyone needs to do a CURRENT EVENTS checklist before they go off on how bad they think tipping would be.
Because in reality, tipping WORKS. PERIOD. I seen the stats. And the stats DO NOT LIE.

And its all about stats.
Wonder what the tipping increments are going to be. That would be awesome to see tips in the range of 140-410 credits for nudity. 140 being the minimum tip possible

There is nothing AT ALL cheap about sites ranked within the top 2,000 in the world. And it doesn't matter what pricing option the model is getting nude at! Everyone is here to work, no matter what pricing option you decide to do your shows at. The facts remain the same about the popularity of tipping. THE STATS remain the same on the popularity of tipping. And that is what matters.


I see 75 percent of people against tipping, and 25 percent for it thus far. The 75 percent against it i'm going to say probably do not know what online search demographics and online traffic metric companies are. And even if you are aware of how popular it is. Then that doesn't mean you have to like tipping. But at the same token if you say something along the lines of how it will definitely do this or that without knowing tippings track record then thats where a little research needs to be done on the successful results of tipping.


I was going to hold back a bit and not comment on others comments, but when I see comments like these, it just makes me laugh a bit to myself. And I know this is going against my whole theory where I said don't comment on a specific part of a previous users comment and just give your opinion first on " Tipping."

But at the same token after hearing numerous comments already I decided that I should comment on this one. And i'm really starting to believe that people say comments like these just so I can laugh more. Where in Andrew Hammer or VS John's comment are people not understanding that what we do here at flirt is get naked?

If people believe that it is sleazy to get naked then maybe getting naked just isn't your thing. Because I know that getting nude is my thing as well as millions of other people too! lol. And maybe the defintion of sleazy should be changed to....

Entry: slea�zy
Pronunciation: sle-ze


1 : A fantastic person who loves to work "hard"


And again, we have the correlation between getting nude and quote "pocket change." VS John had stated something about strip clubs and getting one dollar tips. The money amount doesn't matter. It is all the same.

So are people saying that it is sleazy if you get nude and make only one dollar? BUT ...... then if you get nude and make a million dollars then its not sleazy its called high class and glamorous sleaziness or something? And then I know i'll get a reply about this that dives into a smaller branch and further takes the whole discussion about whether or not tipping is good, off topic. hahahahahahahahha

We are here to work. Anything else?
Oh ok....

I'm quite sure that VS media has numerous ideas to implement to make sure that those tips are quite handsome. It would be nice to see minimum tips of 100 or so. And then throw in big tip categories for the models who can pull it off. Because you know, I know and everyone else knows that there are outstanding models here that can bring in those tips. 500-1000, 2000 credits etc.... I know that seems a bit much. But I would love to see tips of that amount. LOL And in reality anyone can garner a big tip. If a customer likes you then a customer likes you.

Who knows what a customer would be willing to spend on someone. And these tips happen instantly. That is what everyone is missing. You get tipped immediately! It is verified and confirmed, before you even have to get nude. And then you get nude for however long you like. And then a new set of customers come to the room and want to see you nude and you get tipped over and over again till you get happy. At least this is how it works on the other sites that I have viewed using the tipping methods.

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In other words -- " We at flirt are welcoming all freeloading lurkers to sit and for free at someone elses expense"



I'm pretty sure they are called "grey users" and not freeloaders. The greys will get their way believe it or not. And yes that is how that works.
And the sites using the tipping methods are in the top 500 viewed sites in the world. And in reality I wouldn't call a site "located" at around 500 in the world a joke. I would actually call that site a " SUCCESS." Thanks
Bye. Quote

I'm pretty sure they are called "grey users" and not freeloaders.


Well as you are SO keen on dictioary info

FREELOADER

Noun (plural freeloaders)

One who does not contribute or pay appropriately; one who gets a free ride, etc. without paying a fair share

LURKER

NounSingular (plural lurkers)

1.Agent noun of lurk; one who lurks.


so the 'greys' as you call them will sit on their arses at the pc and wait until someone else decides to ti a performer for a quick show of some type meaning by definition thay are a as i called them a FREELOADING LURKERS.


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If VS media decides to go with tipping then setting up the tipping in a manner that is similiar to what so and so site is doing is actually not that bad of an idea. Seeing that VS is prob one of the most successful sites out there. Then i'm sure they can do it.. If the so and so site is ranked 500 in the world, then the site is ranked 500 in the world. Its like. Period. Dot. Period. Dot. 500 in the world of how many sites out there? a million? a billion? 500... two zero's on the end of that....

I don't know why the majority of the posts do not like this idea or think this idea will not work.

The tipping method will work.

And everyone wants privacy. Well I'm sure VS if they so desire to could set up an Ultra VIP room where you could take the model away from the grey users and away from the level of just normal open room nudity displayed for THOUSANDS of people both grey member and paid member alike, which would occur after an " average tip"

But the thing is ultra vip room would be Ultra expensive to get that one on one that you all love so much.

So that way you can sit back, "grab a popcorn out of the microwave", relax and enjoy your time together with the model of your choice..... Quote

I know that if flirt adopts this idea I'll be on here less. No point stopping by my favourite performers room to chat and joke around with even when not being able to go pvt if the room will just be filled of beggars and free loaders wanting a show.

We all know the "other site" being discussed and if you go into the rooms you realise that the conversations and banter that can take over a room here does not exist. Its simply being asking how much for certain acts and the models asking for tips.
If a model wants to do this they can work there, why should flirt lower is exclusivity and standards which no matter how you spin it is what this idea does.

there are currently more in models in private on this site than the other one even though that site has over 650 models online.





You said you will be on here less.... Well that leaves the door open for someone else to be on here more.. See how that works? Whatever VS decides to go with is going to bring in more customers.
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And here we have the "degrading" word,,etc, etc, etc ,etc, etc, etc,


Here you go. And yes I know I reposted these. But oh well.

Define cheap site? Would you call a site cheap if its ranked number 500 or so on the world wide web? I wouldn't call that cheap at all... I would call that site a SUCCESS!

So before anyone goes off on calling something they have no clue about cheap I suggest you take a look at web statistics and learn a few things about current methods for success.
According to some of the best web statistical pages on the web itself, the sites using these methods of tipping have jumped over 20,000 spots in less then a year.

The method of tipping is the next best thing.. And if VS decides to go with that. Then i'll just be working that much harder.
So I think that everyone needs to do a CURRENT EVENTS checklist before they go off on how bad they think tipping would be.
Because in reality, tipping WORKS. PERIOD. I seen the stats. And the stats DO NOT LIE.

And its all about stats.
Wonder what the tipping increments are going to be. That would be awesome to see tips in the range of 140-410 credits for nudity. 140 being the minimum tip possible

There is nothing AT ALL cheap about sites ranked within the top 2,000 in the world. And it doesn't matter what pricing option the model is getting nude at! Everyone is here to work, no matter what pricing option you decide to do your shows at. The facts remain the same about the popularity of tipping. THE STATS remain the same on the popularity of tipping. And that is what matters.


I see 75 percent of people against tipping, and 25 percent for it thus far. The 75 percent against it i'm going to say probably do not know what online search demographics and online traffic metric companies are. And even if you are aware of how popular it is. Then that doesn't mean you have to like tipping. But at the same token if you say something along the lines of how it will definitely do this or that without knowing tippings track record then thats where a little research needs to be done on the successful results of tipping.


I was going to hold back a bit and not comment on others comments, but when I see comments like these, it just makes me laugh a bit to myself. And I know this is going against my whole theory where I said don't comment on a specific part of a previous users comment and just give your opinion first on " Tipping."

But at the same token after hearing numerous comments already I decided that I should comment on this one. And i'm really starting to believe that people say comments like these just so I can laugh more. Where in Andrew Hammer or VS John's comment are people not understanding that what we do here at flirt is get naked?

If people believe that it is sleazy to get naked then maybe getting naked just isn't your thing. Because I know that getting nude is my thing as well as millions of other people too! lol. And maybe the defintion of sleazy should be changed to....

Entry: slea�zy
Pronunciation: sle-ze


1 : A fantastic person who loves to work "hard"


And again, we have the correlation between getting nude and quote "pocket change." VS John had stated something about strip clubs and getting one dollar tips. The money amount doesn't matter. It is all the same.

So are people saying that it is sleazy if you get nude and make only one dollar? BUT ...... then if you get nude and make a million dollars then its not sleazy its called high class and glamorous sleaziness or something? And then I know i'll get a reply about this that dives into a smaller branch and further takes the whole discussion about whether or not tipping is good, off topic. hahahahahahahahha

We are here to work. Anything else?
Oh ok....

I'm quite sure that VS media has numerous ideas to implement to make sure that those tips are quite handsome. It would be nice to see minimum tips of 100 or so. And then throw in big tip categories for the models who can pull it off. Because you know, I know and everyone else knows that there are outstanding models here that can bring in those tips. 500-1000, 2000 credits etc.... I know that seems a bit much. But I would love to see tips of that amount. LOL And in reality anyone can garner a big tip. If a customer likes you then a customer likes you.

Who knows what a customer would be willing to spend on someone. And these tips happen instantly. That is what everyone is missing. You get tipped immediately! It is verified and confirmed, before you even have to get nude. And then you get nude for however long you like. And then a new set of customers come to the room and want to see you nude and you get tipped over and over again till you get happy. At least this is how it works on the other sites that I have viewed using the tipping methods.





Well Bud, its like this I know several models who have worked both sides of this fence (I TALK TO THEM DAILY) and believe u me if they could get back to this side they would ... the 'do it all for free/tips' works for a few and against a lot. If your model is purely stats and $$$ u rite on track, if u think u just gonna have ta get nude for tips ur kiddin' urself .... the benchmark for a 20 credit tip gets to levels that r so degrading its hard ta fathom ... but I guess for u thats OK? The 'hot' rooms on those sites r normally not based on personality, bieng attractive or sexy but about how far u'll push the boundries to attract a crowd. I'm all for models makin' a shitload of money but not at the expense of having them compete for tips based on what they are willing or not willing to do in public. What a model decides she/he is prepared ta do in pvt is entirely up to them, but when the benchmark is set by what is done in public you gonna have a problem. CHEAP is not a ranking its a value, to date this place has had some. Dunno where u got the sleazy word from I neva mentioned it. Quote

Well as you are SO keen on dictioary info

FREELOADER

Noun (plural freeloaders)

One who does not contribute or pay appropriately; one who gets a free ride, etc. without paying a fair share

LURKER

NounSingular (plural lurkers)

1.Agent noun of lurk; one who lurks.


so the 'greys' as you call them will sit on their arses at the pc and wait until someone else decides to ti a performer for a quick show of some type meaning by definition thay are a as i called them a FREELOADING LURKERS.







This exact " Freeloading" as you like to call it, or as I like to call it " grey user" is a key component in what makes the so and so site number 500 in the world. But, yet again. It is NOT the only component that makes this site so successful.

Given that the majority of the people here do not realize how big of a company VS Media really is or should I say that to me personally it would appear that given the comments from the people here they do not realize how popular VS Media is then I think it would be wise to watch what you say about a successful company.....

This is their show. We are all just giving our feedback.

But at the same token some of this feedback is feedback that is being given without full knowledge of the power of TIPPING.

And then yet again some of the feedback is feedback with the full knowledge of the power of TIPPING and it is your own personal opinion.

And then some of the feedback are people claiming to know what the TIPPING SITES do but are against them and like the current site here.

And then yet again some of the people here claim to know exactly what these sites do but if i asked you exactly where that site is located on the world wide web ranking then I'm going to make an educated guess and say that you wouldn't know.........

So it is a variety obviously. Some like it. Some don't. I like the " idea" of tipping.

The statistical world-wide web-site ranking numbers speak for itself....

Brad said it in a post before. That VS is currently looking into and currently pondering adapting to whats new.

And as far as CURRENT EVENTS are going.

Tipping is the next best thing. Quote

Wonder when the tipping if it gets the go ahead will be ready to go in effect.
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Love to know where you get the magic number of 500 from. And as far as saying 'tipping is the next big thing' errr flirt had tipping in open chat when i first became a member FIVE YEARS ago, then the site removed it, so yeah a REAL new idea 'rolls eyes'. Go back to doing what you seem to do best from what i recall the last time you spent an amount of time on the forums -- loving yourself. Must be so hard for you to see much as you seem to have your head stuck so far up the arse of vs. Quote

Wonder when the tipping if it gets the go ahead will be ready to go in effect.




Here's a tip for ya,

DON'T EAT YELLOW SNOW
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Guys keep it polite please.

Traffic data for flirt4free


http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/flirt4free.com


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JJ.. who the hell let y0u back on the forums? Many of the members here know EXACTLY what the tipping is at other sites. Yet they choose to be here instead. Any reason? Of course there is... because currently Flirt is a cut above the rest. Not a cookie cutter clone of a cheap site. Sites where for tips of maybe 100 tokens has a woman using a "bat" on herself because this is what she is "tipped" for and she is just sitting in open all day and not on privates. Whee a mom has sex with what is said to be her son for "tips" because she wants to make a few credits. Where a model's topic is... 100 tokens for anal. So instead of maybe even a 300 credit show for ONE person it would be 100 credits for however many members are in the room. After that show, WHY would any of them go private? You know they already. And let's not forget about how so many idiots record and post shows all over the internet. If you are doing shows in an open room, then you leave yourself VERY vulnerable to this by 1000s of members or non members.If you look at one of the "clone" sites, there can be over 500 models on and less than 20 privates because there is no need to go private when you can see everything you wish for free. So don;t say members and models do not know about these second rate sites, because we do.



Was JJ banned from these forums? Quote

The numbers 500-2,000 or even 5000-11000 are exactly why the majority of everyone who says this won't work needs to do a bit more research or "homework" on the methods of tipping. And maybe take a little look at some "specifics."

Maybe flirt did have something like that. But that was five years ago. That was then. The internet isn't even that old.
and .....

This is now. lolz

Re-edit that FIVE YEARS and put an underline under it. Because its a full 2 years more then i've been here.

Also on a side note. Yes i'm going to agree with whatever my company decides is going to be the best for us all. lol??

Or it really isn't agreeing yet now is it. It is just merely a company project "idea" being thrown out there in the "air" so that we as models and customers can give our " views." It really doesn't mean my head is up anything.
Only in a little thought does it think it is.

These are all "normal" things a person will do when your an " employee" of a company. And even if I disagreed I would say so. As I have done with regards to other things such as certain aspects of the VOD system that I didn't like.


I actually happen to like this little concept of " tipping."
Think its going to work if implemented.

Anything else?
Oh ok........

Maybe VS might lose some "faithfull" customers. BUT at the same token.

If VS gains 10,204 new customers on top of what it is gaining now and within those 10,204 new customers gains 21 "hardcore faithfull VS cusomers" for every single " 1 " of the original customers now saying that they are going to not come on here. ............

THEN it would appear that VS made a victorious business move for itself and everyone else involved..

And its not even like "if" VS does this tipping, that they are just doing it to make everyone mad. That is not the case. I'm pretty sure according to the comments i've seen from management that they are going to do it to draw in more customers. It is not meant to hurt anyones feelings.

And not only that. I'm pretty sure its going to draw in more outstanding performers like myself that are going to be willing to work for them. And then that will make all you customers happy. You will be like wow look at all these new performers that we get to take private.

And I would actually call that a "smart" business move.

Bye.


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